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Review of the Honda ANF 125 Innova - By Peter Hawker
Uneasy Rider
I’m an elderly touring cyclist and during my last few trips, principally in mountainous regions of France, I’ve toyed with the idea of motor propulsion, a scooter with a small engine just powerful enough to carry me and my camping gear. A small engine would ease my conscience I thought. In my long gone youth I rode a 250cc motorcycle for just a few years, so a scooter with a foot operated gearchange should come naturally to me. I thought! The Honda ANF 125cc Innova is the only example I know of that has such a control and it should carry me and my gear, which isn’t heavier than a pillion passenger. It is a development of the renowned Honda Cub, that 90cc machine that was ridden everywhere. I recall an article about a chap who rode one around the world on one carying ‘everything but the kitchen sink’. I felt for him, having to remove all that of luggage every time he filled up, far too frequently.
So it was really nostalgia that determined my choice and I was lucky to see on ebay a three year old example almost on my doorstep with only 350 miles on the clock - £1,250, delivered. Done!
Rode it around the garden and got into second gear, then ventured onto the fortunately quiet road where I wrestled with the challenge of changing down smoothly. It was a while before I realised that lifting my left heel after selecting the gear was the equivalent of releasing a clutch. I’m still trying to develop a sensative left foot.
Other reviews of the Innova have been written by motorcyclists who comment about it’s lightness and the narrow tyres. I’m a cyclist and to me the scooter is relatively heavy and the tyres are wide. I’m still trying to excercise the good slow riding control that comes naturally on my pushbike and to ride faster than 30mph without feeling so nervous. Motorists are resigned to overtaking cyclists but expect scooters to keep up with the traffic and I irritate them.
I now realise how easy it is to hang panniers on my cycle, with its front and rear racks, but the scooter required considerable ingenuity to secure them safely. I’ve accomplished my first one-night camping trip without incident, except that it rained hard coming home and I drove very cautiously, particularly around corners. I’ve fitted a screen and the improvement in comfort is significant, but it hasn’t wipers and I was peering through both the rain obscured top half and my glasses as I crawled along. I’m nervous about that very efficient front disc brake in the wet, fearful that I’ll instinctively grab it in an emergency and come off.
Disadvantages (after only about a hundred miles): The limited protection to my lower legs compared with other scooters and the stiff rear suspension. I’ve ridden a mountain bike along very rough tracks and it’s suspension was much better.
I’m looking forward to my first camping trip in France next year, in regions that I’ve explored on a bicycle. Now I’m considering clothing for cold weather riding, at considerably higher speeds that on my bike. Chillier!
Reader's Comments
said :-
I found the Innova great for touring in France . I had lightweight camping equipment in a 50 litre rucksack strapped onto the back with bungee cables , of course had to remove every time I filled with petrol but it only took a couple of minutes . I travelled from Gloucester to Cadaques in Spain (round trip of just under 2000 miles )and back in a beeline.Took the Weymouth - St.Malo ferry.Plenty of campsites never a problem finding one in the evening , couple of times anxious about running out of fuel though ,most of the village petrol stations have closed and had to use town supermarket petrol stations mainly, I might consider taking a 1 litre flask of petrol next time . Just staying on the 'd' roads mainly is so enjoyable. I have since bought a rack but not fitted a topbox yet , I suspect the handling might not be so good with the weight too far from the centre of gravity . There are lots of accessories for the Innova available in Asia that you cant buy in the UK , I bought back a basket that fits on the front and luggage carrier that fits in the gap between seat and handlebars so will experiment with how to load it next time . I carry 2 litres of water in a platypus water carrier that fits under the seat , this is good for keeping weight in the right place . Mini trangia for a little cooking but not really necessary as great to hang out in cafes in France. I havnt got a windscreen and need to wear lots of windproof clothes to keep warm even in summer , these double as nightwear in order to carry a 700gram sleeping bag . Cant wait till next trip ! Oh the guy who travelled round the world on one had a modified larger petrol tank that filled not from under the seat so he didnt have to unload to fill up - it was modified to use by Australian Post Delivery Service. Have a good trip - the hardest part is getting to ferry port in the UK on very busy roads once in France the roads are deserted .
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Peter Hawker said :-
Dear Ren,
I've only just seen the article by the chap who toured with an Innova in France. Very encouraging.
regards, Peter.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
I reckon if ya not in a big rush and would like to actually SEE the place you're travelling through then an Innova is ideal. Cheap to run, reliable and lightweight. The fuel is the only problem, 80 mile range is useless.
I have heard a tale of a 15 litre motorcycle fuel tank being bolted into the step through area and connected up. Never seen it though...
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Fraser Gray said :-
Yes,a great bike for sedate touring;I've taken mine to the Hebrides a few times. Tip- get a top box and keep a litre of fuel in it;no more worries about running out. I also strongly recommend that you put ultraseal in your tyres(I'm not advertising!)..the bike is notorious for rear punctures and this stuff is amazing.It's no fun fixing a flat in the middle of nowhere (altho' quite do-able,carry a couple of small tyre levers;they'll fit under the seat,and an ordinary bicycle punture repair kit) But prevention is better than cure. Enjoy!
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
said :-
Hi all, some very interesting comments/stories on here. I bought a 2006 honda innova 3 years ago in 2008, only 600 mls on the odometre! cost £1100 at the time but sadly sold it again in 2009 for £1000. Im now missing owning one & looking to purchase another one, i have noticed they are now holding their price really well, ie: 2004/2005 typically £700-£800 & more!im guessing this is down to fuel price increases & of course the reputation of the Honda name & its reliability factor. Thanks to everyone for all the tips & info, especially the one about the ultraseal, sounds great! will have to check this out.
Regards... John.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Russ said :-
I brought my 2004 innova from a lad near me for £400, bargain. Brought it to get up my no claims, but now I've ridden for a few months I love it, use it everyday for my 40 mile round trip to work, sits happily at 55mph and I'm returning over 140 mpg, was going to sell it next year and get back on a fire blade but with fuel prices, what's the point.... This bike s amazing, well done Honda. Top job
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Rob. said :-
Hi im thinking of touring france on my 08 innova next year, going this year on my 400 majesty but with high insurance ect im thinking of selling her and just keeping my innova, i get just as much or more fun riding this little scoot than the majesty and 140mpg cheap tax and insurance, done the big bike speed thing, now want mpg and a chance to see the world. Rob.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Ian Campbell said :-
from Boksburg south africa I regulary ride fromJoburg fromcapetown on myanf 125 Deputy model drum brakes carburetter model of anf series this distance is1600 kms we will do any thing from 750kms to 450kms in a day. yes can feel the heat on ankle on these days my bike has43692 kms on clock no problems as yet and do not expect any change oil after all long runs irespective of dtstance.one mod I suggest is mandatory and makes anf best small bike of all change front sprocket from14teeth to15teeth. this mod is magic and changes bike for best.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Glyn Lewis said :-
Took my 2003 Innova from Northants to AArhus, Denmark via Harwich/Hook of Holland. Never missed a beat even in non-stop Dutch rain. Did the trip in two days but as others have said, fuel range is dismal so I always carry a litre and a half in an old oil bottle as a precaution. I also keep a boottle of tyre weld handy just in case. Next trip on it is Arhus to Alta in Norway!Great little machine and far more fun than my 750 Honda.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
bertie b. said :-
i have been toying about buying a 125 innova for a few years now,to carry it on my campervan,do you guys have any problems with the gear system on this lovely little motor.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
annon said :-
is there anyone who can give bertie b some advice on his question about the gear change on this little honda.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Steve said :-
I have none Bertie b, what sort do you mean?
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Steve said :-
Just like to add I recently bought an '03 Innova and despite the lack of love by previous owners neglecting service schedules and looking after it etc its still going strong at 23,000 miles. Now I have it ive replaced the oil, new chain&sprockets, spark plug and adjusted valve clearances and many other little things, and am getting 152mpg, super little step thru. Sadly there doesn't seem to be any website dedicated to them like there are for other bikes.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Ian B said :-
I have just bought a 2009 Innova with just over 2000 miles on the clock.
It seems to ride well at about 45 miles an hour but does not have much left after that, does anyone out there know if Innovas are restricted in anyway?
Also in the hand book it talks about using Honda 10W 30 4 stroke motorcycle oil or equivalent but the only Honda 10w 30 oil that I've seen is being sold on EBAY for lawn mowers! so what oil is everybody using?
I see that one of rider carries a spare litre of petrol in a empty plastic oil container it sound a good idea but would you do you consider this to be a safe container for petrol?
I'm thinking of spraying the frame and the wheel spokes with some type of protective wax
as I think otherwise it could very soon begin to look a bit tatty!
I'm an old motorcycle rider who thought I had finished with bikes but my little Innover has given me a new lease on life!
.
I look forward to any help that you Innover riders can offer a new owner like me.
Thanks Ian B
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Henrik said :-
Congratulations with the Innova !!! such a nice little machine, I am lucky to own a 2005 model. I use it for small-trips only, with one night in tent, just
to explore parts of Sweden that is a little to far away for my MTB. But like
Ren said, the tank is a PITA, and exclude this little pearl from being a very
good touring bike. I have to admit on the plus-side I feel very comfortable with seat and position, (can ride it for hours,totally unlike my old GS500).
As for petrol use a dedicated petrol-tank, small one's are available for MC,
I would not take less than 2L. I would definitely try to mount a 5L somehow
on the front, if I was going for longer touring with my Innova
As for the motor-oil, don't bother to much, just use any decent oil that meet
the specs, you would have a hard time killing that engine :-)
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Henrik said :-
:-)
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Ian B said :-
Thanks Henrik.
I think you are probably right about buying a petrol carrier but I must addmit that they do seem a bit expensive compared with the 5 Litre petrol containers!
What is the speed like on your bike , do you think that I am expecting a little to much from mine ?
Good luck with your touring and thanks for your help.
Best wishes Ian B
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Ian B said :-
Please can you tell me have any of you Innova owners fitted a Universal Windshield and what do you think of them for quality (see them on EBAY fof just under £30 delivered)
Thanks Ian B
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Henrik said :-
Hi again, my Innova run's 70-110, all compare, flat road and no wind 95 km/h
Yes, small dedicated carriers cost at least double compared to normal 5L types
https://www.louis.de/artikel/fuelfriend-big-kanister-2-0-liter/10002942?list=56105437
Since I have a plan to add a "vespa-style" front luggage-carrier, in my case
I would just put some normal cheap 5L car-type container on that front-carrier
(for longer trips 10 litres would even make more sense)
Also I would feel foolish, removing all my luggage from the seat, just to add
nothing more than two litres, and then one hour later, after 80 km, standing
there again with the same problem, and nothing left at all,..
If at least you could fill the tank up, (3.7L), that would give you like 150 km to go, and be more in tune with a natural rest, and stretching the legs,.
Anyway if not much other luggage, put the 5 litres behind you, needed be, I did this, even in the mountains of Romania, (how I miss that DRZ-400),...
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
Henrik, you seem to be living the adventurous lifestyle. There's a lot I'd like to know about DK because I hope to tour there one day. Drop me a line renwithnell@hotmail.com.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Henrik said :-
Hi, done, you'r welcome :-)
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Fraser Gray said :-
Hi,Ian B - re your top speed of 45 mph. Check/ replace air filter,clean all grot out of crank case breather.Put the bike on its centre stand and spin the front wheel to check for binding - quite common to get a little of this if the bike's been used in all weather. - But even after all this don't expect much more than a cruising speed of 50-55 ,and that's in still air. If you've been riding into headwinds 45 is just about all you can expect really,unless you are a 6 stone sylph. There may also be a bit of grot in the carby if the bike had been standing for a while before you bought it. You can get a complete carb overhaul kit,including jets,for about 15 quid,and it's an easy carb to work on.Just be careful when you're taking all the plastic panels off the bike,that's actually the most time consuming part of the job.I recommend that you get a set of JIS cross head screwdrivers,as all the crosshead screws are JIS ( Japanese Industry Standard),as you stand a reasonable chance of knackering them if you try and remove them with a Phillips screwdriver.The screws on the carb are also JIS and they are especially liable to burring if you try and use a Phillips. Best of luck.
01/01/2000 00:00:00 UTC
Wuyang said :-
Owned a carb and two injection innovas. The carb innova has more umph, it needs to be knocked down less through the gears when against a head wind, but also holds its revs and climbs through the revs more freely.
When going slowly on country lanes very little difference in engines. Once the injection innova gets it revs up it will do the same as the carb innova, it just doesn't hold onto the revs as well.
Few less rattles on injection innova, this can be sorted on carb innova by putting some silicone between headlight and plastic surrounding it. Injection starts on the button, the carb needs a bit of choke before it ticks over.
Loved all mine, but prefer the more fun engine feel of the carb innova. Injection also has halogen 35/35 bulb which is superior to the carb light. The injection bulb can be upgraded again to a Phillips 60/55 Eco bulb that draws 20% less power than a standard halogen, which allows the innova to run on it.
The Honda innova and the Honda sh300 are my favourite bikes by a long way.
30/04/2016 07:59:09 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
Thanks Wuyang, some great information there. I would have thought the injection model would have been more powerful, I guess the catb runs a tad richer. Did you find any difference in the fuel consumption?
Ive never ever heard of the Phillips eco bulb either. That could be a great modification for my own 125.
I've never ridden the SH300. What makes that such a great bike? They certainly look smart.
02/05/2016 06:25:16 UTC
Mac said :-
Thinking of buying one of these famous bikes. I'm 6'2". Am I too tall?
Thanks.
Mac
22/06/2016 15:44:58 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
Hi Mac. Too tall is for you to decide. You should physically fit onto the Innova as it is a full size bike. However you may find it cramped. The best way to find out is to go and sit on one!
23/06/2016 04:24:12 UTC
Henrik said :-
Mac: I am 183 cm, and find it ok, also for longer trips, much better than feks a standard GS500 suzuki, you cant just compare seathight only, becourse the hole sit-position is diffrent, more upright, and comfortable, but 3,7 l fuel is a PITA, and the engine is to the weak side compared to other 125's, my is also not so good on fuel-consumption as the hype says, would try the new address 110 insteadt today
23/06/2016 04:39:21 UTC
David said :-
Bought my 2010 injection model in terrible state from a pizza company, but it was cheap. Spent a couple of weeks securing and painting mixed bodywork panels and gave it a thorough service. I am now happy with it. It goes very well, 55mph cruising speed even with 88000 miles on the clock. Really cheap transport that I will use as a London hack.
06/03/2017 08:11:09 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
88,000 miles! That's some good going there. I reckon the Innova will be perfectly suited to the London street and I guess the Pizza delivery company did too. Don't let that stop you taking it out of London to explore the rest of the UK though.
06/03/2017 09:20:51 UTC
Norm said :-
I'm 6.2 and find my Innova very comfortable. 2006 carb model cruises at 55 and will do 60/65 if you wring it's neck. Love riding it
20/08/2017 23:04:54 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
Thanks Norm. Recently a friend got an Innova for his campervan. He's more used to ZZR1400 and other such hyper-motorcycles but he and his wife still had a hoot on the Innova.
Just looking on the Honda site is seems the Wave 110 (nearest relation to the Innova) is no longer listed. Shame, quite like the Wave too.
21/08/2017 13:30:49 UTC
said :-
04/10/2017 08:32:40 UTC
Rob said :-
Hey guys, where's the coolant tank on these little bikes?
22/10/2017 11:46:08 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
They are air cooled Rob.
22/10/2017 16:17:20 UTC
Simon said :-
Hi, I'm thinking of riding my little honda from here in ireland down to our house in southern france.Its a 400 mile trip and I was thinking,does anyone know how many miles a day I could realistically travel. I'm 68 so rest breaks would be quite frequent. Thought it might be a fun trip.
06/05/2018 18:26:12 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
It all depends Simon! In my opinion 100 miles a day is a good place to start but that would make a 4 day trip.
200 miles is perfectly manageable if your experienced even on a 125. However I wouldn't recommend it for your first time.
I'd suggest 3 days. I'd also suggest a couple of days before racking up a few miles at home to see how you get on.
06/05/2018 20:45:16 UTC
Rod said :-
Hi Simon,
Ireland to Southern France. Which way are you planning to go to Southern France which is only a 400 mile ride?. Should the 400 be a 4000 mile round trip?
The mileage you can cover in one day has many factors.
Are you camping : You need to be at your campsite earlier than if you are staying in a hotel.
What time of year are you travelling : Hours of daylight are shorter in the winter, and the standard lights on many bikes are only adequate.
How comfortable is the bike and what is its average speed : This will have a big impact on the mileage you can cover (or want to cover).
How many miles do you normally cover in a day : The more you ride, the more comfortable you will be on the bike.
By far the biggest factor is the mileage which each individual is happy to cover in a day.
Age 68. I was talking to a guy at the ferry last year, he had just covered a 600 mile ride to the ferry, and he was in his 70's. He was riding a BMW1200RT though, not a 125 Honda.
10/05/2018 07:26:48 UTC
Ren - The Ed said :-
Cheers Rod. There's a lot more to it than meets the eye in such a simple question.
10/05/2018 15:37:15 UTC
said :-
18/05/2018 14:48:24 UTC
Roger Foyle said :-
Interesting comments above everyone so thanks
Mine is an 03 reg carb model and runs really well
As regards spare fuel - don't spend a fortune on special tanks or
risk using second hand containers - Screwfix do a really strongly
made plastic 1 litre container for under £4 -intended for chain saws
I cut away part of the black plastic from under the seat where the tools and handbook
fit, and my spare "tank" easily fits in there along with other tools, two well
wrapped up new inner tubes and spark plugs etc
Does anyone find the ride "choppy" on even slightly bumpy roads and over manhole lids etc ?
Mine shakes me to bits but I am 22 stone
What about different rear shocks ??
05/07/2019 11:54:59 UTC
Daren said :-
I have just seen an Innova for the first time and upon a quick examination I was pleased to see how similar it is to my old Cub 90 which I miss lots, it's funny how as a biker who has had 1000 cc bikes I now find myself wanting a smaller machine. I will be finding a good example of this new discovery
17/09/2019 09:15:06 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
We here at Bikes And Travels Towers are firm supporters of "smaller machines". If you think about it honestly a 250 is sufficient for motorways and a 125 is sufficient for nearly everything else. Then you get better fuel economy, cheaper parts, no hernia when pushing it into and out of the shed, you can thrash it in the countryside and keep your licence and still do all this while looking cool because you don't need 10,000cc to prove "something".
Let us know what you find.
18/09/2019 08:38:43 UTC
Upt'North said :-
It'd take a lot more than 10,000 to make me look cool.
You crazy cat.
Upt'North.
18/09/2019 11:51:47 UTC
Roger Foyle said :-
Bought some new (pattern) rear shocks on Ebay for £42 inc postage and bike now transformed to its former self
Brilliant
17/11/2019 15:51:53 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Glad to hear that Roger as Sharon's just purchased some new Ebay shocks for her 125. What I can't work out is how they can even buy the materials to make the shocks for £42 let alone turn them into shocks, package them, ship them to the UK and then to your home for £42.
18/11/2019 09:35:50 UTC
Roger Foyle said :-
Quite right Ren
Anyway, looking for
ward to some 200 mile day rides this winter with the other pensioners in the 125 club. We all have bigger bikes as well, but have to say that the 125s are more fun !!
23/11/2019 11:10:43 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
125cc is more than sufficient to get yourselves into trouble! I don't want to see news reports of marauding badass hell's angels type pensioners causing havoc on reliable frugal small capacity motorcycles. You behave yourself Roger.
23/11/2019 16:37:50 UTC
Roger Foyle said :-
Anyone got a cheap starter motor for a 2003 Innova please ?
Starts OK on the kick, but I wouldn't mind going electric ?
Would rather buy from a fellow enthusiast than a faceless conglomerate on Ebay !!
Thanks
Roger
24/11/2019 11:13:59 UTC
Phil said :-
I've just purchased a 2004 Innova to chuck on the back of my motor home for sunny day trips around me France Spain and Portugal ! I can't wait !! It'll join a couple of classic peds and vintage Hondas and a modern Yamaha Adventure bike in the stable block but Im now just as excited to jump on my Innova after reading the entertaining previoys posts . Presumably mine will be the carb model ? Any other points to attend to when it arrives to ensure it is running correctly aftrmarket exhaust better intake filter etc ? Thanks Phil
27/01/2020 10:10:21 UTC
said :-
31/01/2020 16:06:17 UTC
said :-
01/02/2020 08:57:56 UTC
Bent said :-
Anybody know how the new Super Cub 125 differs from the Innova 125?
03/02/2020 05:08:38 UTC
Bill said :-
I believe the super cub and monkey share the latest Euro 4 version of the FI 125 engine.
I don't think the Innova is produced anymore
03/02/2020 11:05:30 UTC
Brigueil said :-
What an entertaining page this is! Just stumbled on it while ‘thinking of buying’ lots of Mobylettes and Innovas... my favourite ‘bikes’ ...I had a C90 years ago, now reduced to Ebiking.. At 77 my wife suggests I grow up, but, well, not yet eh....
Keep up the entertainment gentlemen and here’s to the coming better weather!
13/02/2020 23:02:31 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Nothing wrong with a bit of Ebiking Brigueil, it'll keep you active and it's the future don't you know. As for this better weather? Where do you live because here in England the rain just gets warmer.
14/02/2020 11:24:29 UTC
T said :-
Anyone fitted folding bar-end mirrors?
11/06/2020 15:15:04 UTC
Dan said :-
Ive just bought a 2016 Grom 125 but to be honest I prefer the comfort and ride of my old 2013 Innova 125
22/06/2020 20:34:39 UTC
Bogger said :-
I tried a Grom and hated it. I felt like a Gorilla perched on top of it. I know loads of people love em, but not for me thanks.
Still luvin me Innova.
Bogger
23/06/2020 07:10:58 UTC
Steveindenmark said :-
I have a 2012 Honda ANF Injection. I bought it from new and it now has 13000km on it. I have toured 2 up with camping gear in Denmark, Sweden and Germany.I have never found a problem with the amount of fuel it holds as I carry 2 small bottles of fuel under the seat. I dont use motorways and so finding a petrol station before I run out of fuel has never been a problem. By the time you have done 80 miles, it is time for a stretch anyway. It is an excellent lightweight bike. Unfortunately, my Moto Guzzi Breva 750 does not get used much unless we are going on long trips.
26/06/2020 05:38:45 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
I find it curious how many people prefer using their small capacity bikes for touring. This being said we know there's far more "big" bikes out there rather than small so I suspected it's just this website draws in those who enjoy the pleasures 125s and the like. I don't know many who do it 2-up though! Do you have super lightweight kit and do you travel very light? That's one thing I have not mastered, travelling light.
26/06/2020 08:20:38 UTC
ROD said :-
Ren, To master the art of travelling light you need to leave the tent, sleeping pad, sleeping bag, cooking gear, pots pans plates ect at home.
To replace these items you need just one item. A credit card!
As for two up, I am on the weight limit of the bike just taking basic camping gear, and as you know my bike is not a 125.
26/06/2020 08:50:03 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Credit card?!?!??! We're not all wealthy executives like yourself ROD, what with your plush Beemer and you probably have a real garage. Bet you even have a balcony like Mark Noel with his 3D printed millions! I'm not a natural camper but I am naturally tight.
Steveindenmark say he goes 2-up camping on his 125. I imagine he must be very well organised and somewhat minimalistic.
And yes, my CB500X has a limit of 185kg. I'm about 80kg, if there were 2 of me that's 160kg. Then throw on another 5kg for both sets of bike kit. That leaves 20kg for 2 people with tents, pots, pans, food, bedding and clothing. It's norra lot!
26/06/2020 11:04:46 UTC
Upt'North said :-
Leader, yes you our Ed.
Do you know the pay load on your tiddler is about the same as the BeaST. Who'd have thought it.
Although your screen mod is probably 20 kilos.
Rodster, what about the 1150,cant be much more than the 500X?
Upt'North.
Pete's spell checker isn't holf herd wirk toduy.
26/06/2020 13:12:18 UTC
ROD said :-
No Upt' The 1150 is not that much more.
The Curb Weight is 279kg
The Maximum Weight is 495kg
So the payload is 216kg
I have a full breakdown of the weight of all of the gear if you are interested, but for a comfortable camping trip I would still tow the trailer as I can also carry more tools.
26/06/2020 14:18:49 UTC
Upt'North. said :-
I suppose (dangerous) that one thing both the ST and 1150 have going for them weight wise is that the panniers were standard fitment and included in the original weights.
Although the top box even empty has to be about 5 or 6 kg, maybe more.
I know it's too heavy for the Mot testers scales but strangely always passes the MOT.
I think I'll get Er'Indoors on a diet, she'll understand.
Upt'North.
26/06/2020 18:32:38 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Er' indoors will likely batter you Upt'.
ROD, at present I can't see a towbar on the beemer. I'm guessing you have some form of setup that fits quite easily?
27/06/2020 08:39:28 UTC
ROD said :-
Yes Ren, I have fitted brackets behind the footrest plates which attach to dexion type angled metal attached to the underside of each pannier. The tow bar is then fitted to these rails under the panniers and to the rear carrier.
I have also attached rear lighting and a number plate mounting to a top box (a bodge you would be proud of), and can attach another 48ltrs of carrying capacity behind the bike using the same mountings.
27/06/2020 09:45:29 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Next time you have the trailer fitted I'd like to see some images of the setup. And yes, it brings warmth to my otherwise frozen cockles to hear of a good worthy bodge, brings a tear to my eye.
29/06/2020 06:56:43 UTC
Nik Nova said :-
A glory HALLELUIA on that little 125cc Innovas! Nice to read all the comments! :)
I own a 660 Tenere and a MotoGuzziLeMans, but my last trip, I took the little Innova and it was just awesome fun! Much more fun and so easy to travel than on bigger bikes. I rode 600km in two days over several mountain passes (in southern part of Switzerland) to Lake Como and back. Carried just basic camping gear (ultralight zpacks tent, mat and sleeping bag and not much more in a top box. 1.5lt jerrycan fuel canister was helpful in some point). Biggest fun was to overtake BMW GS1200 bikes up- and downhill! ;)
This year in March, I planned to ride my Innova to Genova, take the ferry to Morocco, ride some desertsands for three weeks and then ride back to Switzerland by Spain and Portugal another three weeks. The trip was cancelled by covid.
Only thing is the seat.... my butt hurted after two days. Need to find a solution... sheep shin, merino underwear, gel pad,.... and maybee invest in some suspension upgrades. Ride safe & have fun!
05/09/2020 21:16:12 UTC
Bogger said :-
Yes, Innova seats are utter rubbish. I've had three Innovas and all the seats were/are crap. I had my last one remade as a gel seat. It was still crap. The one I have now is exactly the same.
But I do know what the problem with them is. It's definitely not what they are made of. It's the design/profile of them.
The overall height is fine, but the rear of the seating part for the rider is higher at the back than at the front. This sort of pulls at the skin on your legs as your weight is canted forwards. The seat also drops away on each side so it's like sitting on top of a dome.
In a nutshell the seat needs reprofiling to a much flatter form. More akin to the seats of the UJM bikes of the 1970's and 80's. Keep the height but do away with the canted forwards dome rubbish.
Incidentally the comfiest bike seat in the world, ever, is the Honda CD200. Fact.
I keep promising myself I'm going to get it done. But that costs money and I'm tight.
Otherwise it's great bike...…….with a rubbish fuel range.
Bogger
06/09/2020 10:21:48 UTC
Upt'North said :-
You've started something now Bogga Me Lad.
Old flat seats with proper peg positions front and rear, heaven. Sweet memories.
When did manufacturers forget what we use the bikes for?
They'll even sell you a better seat when you've just bought a brand new bike because the standard one is useless. AND, people buy them! Then how about some nice peg lowering mounts?!?
Upt'North.
06/09/2020 10:32:45 UTC
Ian Soady said :-
You don't need to spend a fortune to reprofile your seat. Some foam, spray glue and 2-way stretch vinyl can give a very acceptable job for £20 or so.
Here's the one I did for my Honda 400: Before
06/09/2020 12:08:18 UTC
Ian Soady said :-
... and after. A bit rumpled but then so am I.
06/09/2020 12:08:54 UTC
glyn lewis said :-
ANF125/Innova brilliant little bike perfect for around town or nipping to shops. Only drawback is the puny fuel tank. Rode one from Northants up to Tromso in N Norway where it now lives registered and used by my son. Never go wrong, easy and light to use and great mpg. Current model the fuel injected one which on average I use more than any of my bigger bikes which have ranged from C50s to FJ1200s in size.
06/09/2020 12:25:45 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
It's good to hear some love for the Innova. Thank you folks.
Regarding moderns seats. While I find the seat on my CB500X to be "acceptable" most of the peculiar odd shapes we see (suffer?) these days are down to that old enemy of function, form. While it drives ME to despair the way recent models make working on them harder, seats less comfortable, multi-mode mapping, ABS TCS Anti this that the other and so on, I have to remind myself motorcycle manufacturers are not selling motorcycles to people like ME.
The buyers of brand new motorcycles in the UK (or The West) are motivated by style, fashion, big power numbers and things we can boast about in the pub ("Oh it's got 17 modes and DiTetrohedral Dynamic Anti Graviton Stability Assistance"). With an average of 3 to 4 thousand miles covered a year who cares what the seat is like as long as it looks good.
BUT! The Innova's target market would be in countries where function is far more important than form. Where buyers want as much reliability as possible and if it does break down it needs to be cheap, easy and quick to fix. So it looks like Honda dropped the ball if the seat is that bad. Maybe people in Vietnam and India sit differently?
07/09/2020 08:03:28 UTC
Bogger said :-
They are probably a lot lighter, so don't suffer as much.
Bogger
07/09/2020 12:55:53 UTC
ROD said :-
Yes, But they ride with four people on the bike!
07/09/2020 13:17:14 UTC
nab301 said :-
"Maybe people in Vietnam and India sit differently?"
Side saddle ?
Nigel
07/09/2020 14:01:42 UTC
Bent said :-
Good to see you guys having such enthusiasm for the Innova. Got me a 2010 model in april, to have some fun on daytrips under this corona period. A very rare model here in Norway. Don`t think it was ever officially imported. I got fascinated by its important history, and did not expect it to offer such great fun. After riding 2500 miles I will change the tires. One is 14 years old! What experiences do you have with different brands and models?
04/10/2020 03:15:08 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
I can't speak for the Innova but on my own 125 I've been very happy with the wet weather grip and acceptable longevity on the Michelin City Pro. Continental Go! are OK too but not as good in the wet.
05/10/2020 08:58:23 UTC
NativeWarrior said :-
Just bought an Innova. 09 plate with less then 8k miles. Need to complete CBT then I'm good to go. Will need a new front tyre soon. What do you recommend ?
09/04/2021 13:55:39 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
IF my google search is correct and the front tyre is a 70/100 R17 then I've been pleased with the Michelin City Pro that I use on my CBF125.
12/04/2021 18:53:20 UTC
Bogger said :-
I recently struggled to get hold of decent tyres in the correct size for my Innova. In fact, from my usual sources, I could find none. The only tyres in the correct sizes were 'off road' tyres.
So I had a look at my Honda c125 Super Cub and The tyre sizes were, front 70/90-17 and for the rear 80/90-17. So I ordered a set of Michelins in these sizes. Everything was fine, the Innova rode and handled really nice.
It was a great bike, so I sold it about six weeks ago?
Bogger
13/04/2021 08:58:16 UTC
Rev. Mick. said :-
I ride an 05 Innova and am still under 10 k on the clock. Bought from a man in 2019 who had tied on the back of his camper van. I think he untied it again to sell it to me. He even had dropped the price by a quarter before I got there. Really did not have the gall to haggle.
I live in the far West of Ireland and it is about perfect for the small lanes here. Though once again fuel capacity is a hassle. A Fuelfriend 2 litre with flexispout.
Also I arrange my throw over pannier straps so I can lift seat to fill.
I was off to Spain but the Covid rules have stopped that until we get vaccinated and green passport Ed.
09/06/2021 09:08:44 UTC
Rev. Mick. said :-
Would a few like minded owners like to form an Innova association/club/forum/Grand Touring society/harriers/gonna go far?
09/06/2021 09:13:04 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
That's a simple yet effective way of mounting the saddle bags Rev. Mick.
Regarding an owner's club? Why not! I'm not sure how many Innovas are out there though, particularly in Ireland. If you're thinking on a more worldwide scale there's already a German forum with some English posts on and Google Translate is your friend (or learn German). I'll add a link...
There's also plenty of C90 groups that have grown to encompass the Innova as well as the countless other variants (CT110, Cub 125, etc etc etc). Then it comes down to your good self and whether or not you want to put the work in to create the group. I'll wish you all the success possible but I'd warn you, running a group of any significant size is difficult and often thankless.
https://www.honda-innova.de/...
09/06/2021 10:54:37 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
Just to prove you wrong, thanks Ed.
Now get on with it.
Upt'North.
09/06/2021 11:51:09 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Luckily Upt' I don't think this humble website constitutes a group of significant size. We non-wheelieing quiet exhaust piped taxed insured MOTd try to keep to the limits types are what we might call a minority. Wait a minute...! If this is a minority website surely there'll be some government funding someplace?
09/06/2021 19:02:15 UTC
Andy said :-
Hi all this is my latest innova seat which is now super comfy.
23/07/2022 20:34:57 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
It surely look comfortable Andy.
26/07/2022 12:19:33 UTC
Andy said :-
Yeah it really has transformed the bike,
27/07/2022 11:20:52 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Several have commented on the seat being a bit, err, firm. Do you manage to rack up a lot of miles on the Innova Andy?
27/07/2022 16:46:21 UTC
Andy said :-
I also have a yamaha townmate T80 and a honda c90 cub both are quite comfortable to ride I bought the innova about 3 months ago off a friend of mine
But soon realised that it was very uncomfortable with the standard seat on .
I am planning a weekend trip away around Lincolnshire before taking on any further a field trips .
The most miles I have covered in one day is about 60 and is very good compared to the standard seat.
27/07/2022 21:46:30 UTC
said :-
27/07/2022 21:53:55 UTC
said :-
27/07/2022 21:57:24 UTC
Andy said :-
27/07/2022 22:00:53 UTC
Andy said :-
Finally put the c90 back on the road.
27/07/2022 22:05:54 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
What a splendid selection Andy! The Townmate is an interesting machine - who'da thunk of putting a shaft drive on a bike like that but it totally makes sense. For the target market of countless commuters in the developing world not having to deal with a nasty dirty chain that can eat your pants or dress it makes sense. However it never took off so I can only assume the extra cost and complexity wasn't worth the benefits.
28/07/2022 12:29:17 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
I noted the shaft drive Ed....but they weren't all shaft drive, were they? I'm probably wrong but didn't they make some Hi/Lo chain drive autos? Memory is a wonderful thing, now where are my glasses.
Upt'North.
28/07/2022 17:00:35 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
To the best of my knowledge all the "TownMate"s were shaft drive Upt'. There may be previous incarnations with other transmissions but I'm not enough of an underbone nerd to be sure. Now - I wonder if the Yamaha shaft can be grafted onto the original Honda Cubs?
29/07/2022 08:18:18 UTC
Andy said :-
The yamaha Townmate came in the 50cc and 80cc 4 strokes 4 speed both shaft driven.
The yamaha V range 50,70,75,80 and 90cc machines all 2 stroke and chain driven.
Regarding converting the cub to shaft drive a chap I knew once did this but I do remember him saying it was a lot of work involved making bracket,spacers and welding etc.
29/07/2022 17:51:39 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
Thank you for clarifying Andy.
I thought I'd seen a little Cub like Yammy with a chain, I still think some had two speed transmission. I.E. Hi Lo settings.
Upt'North.
29/07/2022 18:45:44 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
4 stroke with chain and Hi Lo.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1984-yamaha-townmate-v50m-8-months-mot-7700-miles-rar...
29/07/2022 18:49:26 UTC
Andy said :-
Nice little bike, 2 speed auto (no gear lever) hi and box 2 stroke .
29/07/2022 20:47:09 UTC
Jon Perry said :-
Rev Mick
I like that soft pannier arrangement. Are they attached anywhere other than at the top where they are thrown over? I've got some Wolfman Expedition throw over panniers but they're supposed to attach to a rack at the sides and I can't see anywhere on the Innova where I could attach them. Also I can't find a rack that's intended for panniers that fits the Innova.
26/09/2022 16:35:44 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Hi Jon.
Just back in Ireland today after Innova tour, Outer Hebrides, Skye and Argyll coasts and Lochs.
Panniers just rest over fuel tank. The back one’s slide under the open end of the grab rail as if made for the job. When moving my bulk is on the seat when stopped at garage I can lift seat a full tank.
26/09/2022 19:19:14 UTC
Jon Perry said :-
Sounds like a fantastic trip. I've recently bought an Innova to do similar trips. I'll try out the wolfman panniers tomorrow. The speed I'm sure there will be a way of securing them. Thanks
26/09/2022 21:11:12 UTC
Dae said :-
I took a ferry from Barcelona to Morroco and I rode 12.000km during 90 days from there to Guinea Bissau and Guinea Conakri, crossing Morocco, Western Sahara, Mauritania, Senegal and Gambia and all the way back home. Some days more than 40 degrees, 500km/day and one day i rode 640km. No problems :)
08/10/2022 19:19:54 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
Now that's a ride, I feel very inadequate. It's not the first time.
Upt'North.
08/10/2022 21:28:47 UTC
Crofty said :-
That would make a great ride report with pictures Dae
09/10/2022 08:59:01 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Dae
Love tha Innova colour. Also note you’re using camping hammock. I find they are really good, in many ways much easier than a tent. Just tarp as well and your away. Used them climbing in Spain and on a motorcycle trip in Sri Lanka.
I also have been down into West Africa on Cubs rather than Innovas. We picked them up in Dakar and rode down to Guinea Bissau. I think Guinea Bissau must be the ultimate fun place everything is easy. The standard answer in Guinea Bissau to any problem seems to be “Bo Festa” Let’s Party. Apparently after the Cashew harvest everyone is paid in cash and the party lasts a month. Some of the wildest dance clubs ever.
Just be aware the UK airport security can be very very interested in Guinea Bissau visas in your passport. Apparently the main gateway for South American cocaine into Europe. I got loads of interrogation flying into Bristol. Which was strange coming from Ireland supposedly in the free travel zone.
09/10/2022 15:49:11 UTC
Jon Perry said :-
Wow Dae. That's quite a feat! I've travelled through Morocco on a Transalp but I reckon, if an Innova can handle it, it would be an easier journey. Easier to pick up when you drop it anyway, which I did numerous times riding the Transalp through sand!
13/10/2022 19:37:10 UTC
milly said :-
I have just bought a Peugeot Pox 110cc carb model 3 days ago. Been told they are basically the Honda Innova/wave and not found out much about them. I love the semi automatic transmission not sure what size my fuel tank is yet. Glad I found this page. Agree about the hard seat that will have to change after the comfort of my Aprilia Habana, my 6 year old granddaughter loves going on the back to.
07/06/2023 22:17:42 UTC
milly said :-
Damn forgot to say what got me interested in them it was when a friend travelled from 10 downing street Penang Malaysia to 10 downing Street London on a Innova. He and a few others did it on 125's same I think. He traveled through if memory serves me right China, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, India, Iran, Greece,many European countries and the old eastern block countries then the UK and we met up at his sister's before they shipped them home and he still uses his. Not sure if I can post links here but will try later about there adventure.
07/06/2023 22:26:15 UTC
Norm said :-
If you are looking for a screen, try the Puig one from Germany. Excellent wind protection and looks very neat.Moves the mirrors out a bit for good rear visibility
09/06/2023 16:01:29 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Well I never! Now - is this made by Honda and rebranded? Is this made by some random factory in China or India or Thailand or Brazil... and Honda sells it as their own, along with Peugeot (and likely several other brands)? Is this a rip off, copied by some place where patents and intellectual property mean nothing? I don't know how it all works but I find it peculiar to see quite a few "big brand" models seem remarkably similar to lesser known marques.
09/06/2023 19:17:29 UTC
said :-
This is how it looks on my 2006 carb version
10/06/2023 13:07:12 UTC
milly said :-
This is the link to the touride from Malaysia to the the UK
https://www.slideshare.net/timothywooi/touraride-penang-downing-street-to-london-downing-street
Hopefully put it in the right place
https://www.slideshare.net/timothywooi/touraride-penang-downing-street-to-london...
11/06/2023 19:07:01 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Don’t you just love Cubs and all their derivatives. You’ll get there. It won’t be fast, it won’t be cool and no one will notice.
The perfect vehicle for Loss of Ego?
13/06/2023 10:39:56 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Very Zen Rev. Mick! There is of course an alternative to "losing ego" by riding a diminutive motorcycle. I'm thinking a kind of reverse snobbery whereby some folks are tying to display just how humble and down to earth they really are.
When I was a younger man, filled with an ego yearning to have something, ANYTHING that might get me noticed in the eyes of young ladies, I had little cash. I was also cursed with what is proving to be a lifelong affliction towards working hard. As such I latched on to owning the scruffiest, dirtiest most grotty rat bike I could create. And create I did, it was a (once) prizewinning rat.
Hang on... wait a minute... 30 years on and I've not blummin' changed. Show me the idiot at 20, and I'll show you the idiot at 51.
And yet, honestly? I like, appreciate and would enjoy many of the shiny new performance motorcycles out there and yet I still don't hanker after them.
13/06/2023 19:49:07 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Absolutely spot on.
Oh how many young men are driven by the old sex drive when forming their ideas on buying motorcycles (or indeed any other vehicle). What comes as a surprise years later is that the ladies in our lives had no opinion of and now no memory of those very vehicles that caused our egos such angst.
One girl told me what she remembered of attraction to me at that time was that I washed my hands and my fingernails were clean. I thought being the dirtiest scruffiest most anti establishment figure was most important.
14/06/2023 09:45:14 UTC
Paul said :-
I am thinking of buying one but the petrol tank looks small
07/07/2023 15:05:03 UTC
said :-
11/01/2024 19:42:17 UTC
Art Tidesco said :-
Just bought an '07 Innova called Hildegard with new MOT and only 800 miles on it. Not showing first service completed in the Owners Manual so first jobs, get a Haynes Manual, change oil, brake fluid and tyres all of which look fine but are 17 years old and need to carry 20 stone me. Got a full face helmut from car competition so then off to get some weather proofs and motorcycle boots before going to see if I can pass a test and ditch the L plates at Bristol Motor Cycle Training Centre. Not riden a bike of any sort since a C90 in the mid 80's. Looking forward to tackling the NC500 and maybe a John O' Groats to Lands End when time allows.
15/01/2024 12:05:01 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
Good luck with everything Art.
Put the heater on.
Upt.
15/01/2024 12:43:13 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
It's been a LONG time since you rode the C90 Art Tidesco but I think the Innova will be a sensible and fun place to get going again. And good call on changing the tyres, oil, and brake fluid, they'll be "past their best" for sure. Keep safe, stay legal and enjoy. We'd love to hear how you get on.
16/01/2024 07:51:44 UTC
Alistair said :-
Art - that looks like an amazing find, well done !!
Hi All - I just picked up a 2009 injection model in blue, it’s cosmetically a bit tatty but rides great and the color is gorgeous. I immediately had the seat modified to remove the step and be more like a bench, has made a huge difference to the comfort! I do this with all my bikes as have a custom seat specialist close by (West Yorkshire).
See pic below of my bike currently inside the house ?. Has been a pleasure to read all your comments so all the best to you all.
27/01/2024 21:57:32 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Alistair said - "it’s cosmetically a bit tatty" - Alistair's obviously not seen my 500 on this here blog. Looks mint to me that.
29/01/2024 07:59:44 UTC
Alistair said :-
Haha Ren yes it’s a nice looking bike in that blue but there is a lot of rust not visible in the picture, it’s ok anyway nothing catastrophic
Probably safe to assume that you are more of a “proper biker” vs myself who rides a few miles in the summer and then wheels the bike back into the house
31/01/2024 17:52:09 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
"Proper biker"? Me? The rest of the regulars on here would call me a scruffy oik who's too miserly to put fuel in the car so rides all year round. Be it 10 miles or 10,000 miles just enjoy it Alistair.
31/01/2024 20:05:23 UTC
Alistair said :-
Absolutely!
01/02/2024 19:20:22 UTC
Jon said :-
Only just found this Innova site. I'm putting one together from two tea chest's full of bits & I thought I'd change the front end ! I've got the engine stripped because of big end failure ! Watch this space ?
23/04/2024 23:18:44 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Oh my word! A naked Innova - how rude.
It looks so strange that frame without the context of all the bits attached. Good luck with the build Jon.
25/04/2024 07:54:09 UTC
Lesrev said :-
I’ve only just found this site. Interesting stuff here.
I bought a 2008 (reg) 2006 (built) carb model Innova from a well known salvage site in Dec 2022. Take care when dealing with such people. They took my money on 30th Dec, gave a 14 day ‘return if not satisfied’ guarantee… and delivered the bike on 12th January (do the maths..).
It was category N write-off. Apparently that means frame OK superficial damage only. Huh! Forks smashed, bodywork totally gone.
Anyway, I stripped it, fitted front-end from CB125, and added some home-made bits, LED lights, chopped up the seat, got old pair of trials bars… due to be MoT’ed this week (May 2024). Looking forward to riding it.
What do the owners of ‘proper’ Innovas think of it?
Les
14/05/2024 17:01:08 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Sorry about the above, here’s a better photo of the more complete bike on its way for MoT
14/05/2024 17:10:21 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
Looks fine to me. And probably much cheaper than a proper Innova.....
14/05/2024 17:13:00 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
Ed'll love it.
Hope it passes.
Upt.
15/05/2024 09:11:01 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
That's just FANTASTIC!!! Well done Lesrev.
15/05/2024 10:58:30 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
Told ya.
15/05/2024 11:32:41 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Thanks, I’m flattered that it’s liked/approved of!
A brief rundown of what I’ve done to it in case anyone’s interested
it’s intended to be an ‘Adventure Bike’ (don’t laugh) with a weight similar to my own. I weight 75kg, the bike was 85kg last time I checked. I’m 78 years old (in July 2024) and I wanted something I can lug about.
Front end is CB125F (I think!) but with a CG125 front wheel. Front frame holding speedo, headlights (LED), LED indicators etc is home made from welded 12mm tube, to give good support and provide a ‘pulling loop’ to get the bike out of the mud.
Rear rack is recycled 12mm tube from earlier project, battery-box area is formed from 12mm tube plus 20mm tube, welded to the bike’s frame. That supports the seat in place of the old Honda plastic box and is enclosed in plastic from a yellow B&Q bucket (97pence!).
I’ve jiggled with the wiring so that all the lights are now on DC (not the AC feed for headlight as Honda intended). With all the lights/indicators now LED they don’t draw a lot of power.
I shortened the rear of the frame by a couple of inches and welded in M8 threaded “plugs” to take maybe a rack or rear lifting loop, but have also welded in ‘handles’ to the rear frame similar to the front loop, so three people could easily lift the whole thing clear of the ground, out of the mud, into a van, … you get the picture?.
Presently I’ve fitted a centre-stand (missing when I got it) but removed the prop-stand and its associated plate from the bottom of the engine.
I bought cheap ‘off-road’ footrests and made up plates to use hang them further back (level with swinging-arm pivot) - that meant also making a new rear brake-pedal and modifying the rod to run above the swing-arm rather than in the vulnerable standard position below it.
Other bits a pieces, home made battery box, all that sort of stuff. I have loads of photos if anyone else is on this journey and wants ideas. Now I just need it back with an MoT and I can get it into Wales for a few day rides.
15/05/2024 13:13:42 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
Nice to see nother pensioner making themelves useful!
Presumably passed MoT OK?
15/05/2024 14:02:15 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Still waiting on a busy garage. Hoping for good news by end of the week.
Thought I might be the only old codger here!
Les
15/05/2024 14:55:33 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
They're all old codgers here Lesrev! I think at 52 years old I'm the youngest here.
16/05/2024 07:27:35 UTC
nab301 said :-
Excellent project and just what's needed in terms of weight if you get bogged down or drop it!
Nigel
16/05/2024 16:39:45 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Yea!! MoT with flying colours and no ‘advisories’. I trailered it back home feeling a bit smug and with a lot of head shaking, because I was convinced there would be a problem. The only ‘problem was that the garage owner rode the bike to the testing station and burnt his right boot on the unprotected exhaust pipe.. (sorry Simon!). So nothing to do but take the bike on a RTW simulation, by riding it round the block on my housing estate?♂️
Never having driven a bike with an automatic clutch before that felt odd, and the cyclic gearchange also seemed a bit odd, but it is certainly fun. And different. Maybe a trip to Wales tomorrow if the weather stays good..
Les
17/05/2024 21:58:03 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
Good news Les! The first wheelie I performed was by accident on a similarly equipped Honda C90 in around 1973. I'd never ridden such a bike before, changed into second but kept my foot on the lever and opened the throttle The revs rose astronomically till I released the pedal at which point the front wheel soared into the air. Fortunately mine and the little bike's combined weight soon sorted it out....
18/05/2024 12:02:33 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
Excellent Lesrev. While it might look impressive riding round your housing estate with flaming trousers I think in the long run it'll be more comfortable to fit a heat shield to that exhaust. I suspect you have the skills to fabricobble something suitably safe.
20/05/2024 07:25:36 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Hi Lesrev,
I would be most interested in seeing all your various construction photos, I have had some ideas for my ‘05 carb Innova. I would love to get rid of rattly plastic.
1. Did forks come from breakers?
2. They just bolt straight on?
And the question that intrigues me most:-
Where do all the wires, tubes and pipes go when there is no plastic to hide behind?
23/05/2024 08:58:17 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Heat shield made to order Ed!
23/05/2024 10:05:41 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Rev Mick,
Ooo Err! I’ve got hundreds of photos Mick. How many do you want?
Forks from breakers, they are CBF125 (I think), however, don’t do what I did and try to cobble a different wheel in there, buy the whole front end from a bike and fit that. It saves time effort, frustration and tears.
I lengthened the steering stem by about 25mm (see photo) but that might not be necessary. Originally I used some “CG125 forks” that turned out to be Suzuki (probably 250cc). So buy from a reliable breaker who knows what they’ve got.
I tried to use taper roller bearings, - worked a treat on the Suzuki forks, with a home made sleeve for bottom bearing. With CBF forks they didn’t fit and are a fiddle. You need to know the bearing land sizes on the chosen stem and the frame’s head-tube sizes, and see what bearing sizes are available. It can be a pitfall, so be careful. I ended up with taper-roller bottom and standard Innova ‘cup and balls’ top bearing and even that gave problems as the CBF125 stem bottom land is 1mm too small for bearing. It depends how willing and able you are to play with a lathe and etc.
My wiring stays almost standard except where I made the headlight feed come off the rear light (DC) feed. The loom goes pretty much where it always did. I made a guard for the “down tube” and its fuel lines, wires etc from a piece of old gas-fire backing! Thin ally sheet easily bent and sprayed with etch-primer then yellow paint.
I’ll pop a few more photos up after this to show some of those mods.
Les
23/05/2024 10:26:02 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Rev.Mick
The frame guard looks like this, but your requirements and efforts may be different..
The other, plastic, bit of yellow was cut from a 95 pence BnQ bucket, but they no longer do yellow ones, only black or orange (be mistaken for a KTM?)
The frame on the front of the bike was welded up from 12mm steel tube to hold the original speedo (too darned big!) and LED headlights, mass of front end wiring I tucked into a length of old inner-tube and then into a short length of plastic downspout which is bolted to the home made headlight/speedo frame.. and so on.
Welding figures quite often in my build, as you’ll see.
Les
23/05/2024 10:36:03 UTC
Lesrev said :-
This is ‘my’ front frame. That Innova speedo is a bit of a pain, as it’s very large, but it is good (in my opinion).
23/05/2024 10:45:17 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Rev.Mick
I’m having trouble with only uploading one photo at a time. Is it possible to upload several in one go? Anyone?
Another view of “front frame”
Les
23/05/2024 10:48:12 UTC
nab301 said :-
@Lesrev, you actually cut the steering stem and extended it by fitting a tube inside it and welded it together?
AS for posting photos , it's single only unless you contact Ren and he decides to make a feature .
Nigel
23/05/2024 11:32:46 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Thanks Nigel. That’s OK then.
Les
23/05/2024 12:06:03 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Nigel,
Yes, I cut and extended the steering tube by inserting about 25mm of steel into it. You need to make an extension that gives you a ‘spigot’ either side to go into the original steering tube and stabilises it while it’s welded up. And I also locked mine in the vice jaws to keep it straight while welding. It came out fine. Twice. As I did it on the Suzuki forks and then the Honda ones.
23/05/2024 12:26:28 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
That's coming on very nicely. I'm happy with lathe work but my welding is more on the sticking bits together side so I'd be reluctant to trust a steering stem welded together. Mind you I did shorten the centre and prop stands on my Tiger 955i (using an inner sleeve as you did) as I'd lowered it a couple of inches and they stayed together OK. But if they'd failed it would only be the bike crashing down not me!
23/05/2024 13:06:09 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Ian, I know what you mean, but all the flannel about ‘pretty’ welding on YT etc is just that… flannel. As long as you get the weld down into both pieces of metal it will hold. I’ll confess to grinding off the surface pigeon poo on some of my welds - MIG especially - and the steering tube had to have the welds ground back (as in picture above) because the bottom-bearing inner race had to pass over it. I gave all parts a heavy chamfer, got the welding heat down into it and then sanded it back to size. No breaks so far! But have also welded to make a brake pedal, gear pedal, frame mods, rear racks, etc. it all works. Admitted on an ANF 125 (Innova) it is only going to be doing 50-55mph, so lower stress stuff.
Les
23/05/2024 15:33:12 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
I never got on with MIG but would like to try my hand at TIG - I have a basic machinemart stick welder that will do TIG if I add appropriate accessories.
By the way, doesn't that front light reflect back at you from the perspex?
We seem to be gathering a nice group of bike builders / modifiers here.
23/05/2024 15:47:00 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Kindest Lesrev,
Thank you so much for all your time and help it is appreciated.
I have always loved Cubs and their derivative, the thing I have never really loved is rattly plastic.
24/05/2024 08:55:10 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Rev.Mick,
Where are you in the country? I’m in Cheshire, if that’s near you it might be worth a meet-up so you can get a proper look at my bike before you involve yours in surgery.
Les
25/05/2024 09:53:31 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Ian,
The front lights - there are two cheap Chinese LED units, one for “dipped” the other for “main” - don’t seem to unduly reflect back off the screen in tests in the garage, but if they did I’d cut the screen to let the light out. But I don’t ride in the dark.
TIG welding is fun, but can be difficult at times. The way I do it, it often seems to put more heat into the parts than MIG does. Try it and see.. I use an R-Tech TIG machine (AC/DC) which (on the Innova) I used to weld the alloy silencer and secondary pipe. Ally welding is even more fun (or disastrous)!
Check out YT “KI Hestad” (a Norwegian biker) for a nifty and cheap way of making a welding positioner (turner) for MIG welding, his results are very good and so simple to achieve.
Les
25/05/2024 14:54:36 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
Thanks Les. I don't have anything currently(haha!) that needs welding but will check that out. Many years ago when I was a student apprentice I was OK with oxy-acetylene but rubbish at electric arc - none of this MIG stuff then! I imagine TIG to be more like gas than electric.
25/05/2024 16:09:00 UTC
Rev. Mick! said :-
Thanks Lesrev.
Unfortunately I live about as fat West as you can go in Europe on the Dingle Peninsula in County Kerry in the Republic.
The photos so far are great and have given me ideas to work out.
Problem is, I could go taking things to bits and changing things but I could just go for a ride.
27/05/2024 08:24:51 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Mick,
You keep riding and make any mods a secondary issue. I spend too much time mucking about in the garage when I should be riding. Pulling off the rattle plastic shouldn’t take too long though!
Ride safe mate!
Les
27/05/2024 13:12:38 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Jon,
How did you fit those front forks on your Innova frame? Specifically, what bike are your forks and wheel from, and what steering-head bearings did you use?
I’m having some ‘issues’ with my changed front forks - particularly with the bearings. I’d be grateful for some info.
Les
31/05/2024 15:47:39 UTC
Lesrev said :-
OK, I think I’ve sorted my head-bearing issues.. the taper roller bearing I was using at the bottom of the steering stem was 1mm too big, and I tried to shim it out in various ways with brass shim. Although it passed its MoT there was play between the bearing and the stem when I checked, and eventually the bearing crushed the shim by folding it up.
I’d been dreading doing this job properly, as it needed me to make some kind of sleeve to fit the bearing ID (28mm) and also slide onto the original bearing land (27mm). So the sleeve would be so thin it would likely collapse as I machined it. I finally sorted it by incorporating a band of slightly thicker metal to make a spacer to lift the bearing slightly, as when I lengthened the steering tube I lengthened it too much (measure twice, cut once??). Furthermore, it had to be accurately machined, or the sleeve wouldn’t fit or else would still give me sloppy steering-bearings.
The photo shows the sleeve, made on my clapped out old Myford, plus skimmed to perfect fit on the tiny Taig lathe. And perfect it now is! The sleeve was slid down onto the original CBF125 bearing-land and fixed with loctite.
Phew! Took most of a day to do but now it’s brilliant.
03/06/2024 11:02:40 UTC
nab301 said :-
It's great to have a lathe and the skill to use it , in the same situation I'd probably have to have had the stem metal sprayed and machined by professionals .....
Nigel
03/06/2024 14:31:32 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Nigel, the skill comes with practice and watching certain YT channels., I was never trained (except in Secondary-Modern school 60+ years ago). And lathes can be had relatively cheaply, believe it or not. My Myford was a gift (of sorts) and the simple and very light Taig with plenty of bits and pieces was about £300. And much of motorcycle-relevant turning is not demanding in terms of accuracy, although this job was, to the point of being nerve-wracking! Fortunately the only time I over-cut it was right at the beginning, so it was simple to start again without much loss.
I do enjoy ‘making stuff’ - for my bikes, for the workshop, for other people; so welders, lathes, and other gear are essential for me. Heaven help the people who have to clear this mess when I’m gone!
Les
04/06/2024 08:55:52 UTC
nab301 said :-
Never say never I guess (on the lathe).. Back in the 80's I did a basic evening welding course in a local college which was very useful and meant that after purchasing a cheap MIG welder I've never had to rely on favours for all the basic welding / fabrication jobs that popped up over the years.
Nigel
06/06/2024 12:21:39 UTC
Ian Soady¹ said :-
I wouldn't be without my lathe which I use frequently, mainly to make studs and spacers although occasionally attempt something more complicated. Like this oil telltale I made for the Sunbeam some years ago. For that I used my old Granville (cheap 1950s copy of a Myford) but now have a Chinese Seig which I got second hand for about £250. It's a very accurate and precise - or at least enough for my purposes which generally need a tolerance of up to .005".
06/06/2024 13:13:13 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Nice lathe-work!
I’ve had a go at a simple steam loco, but not finished it (story of my life!) but the tiny Taig lathe managed that including the wheels, plus flywheel, engine-cylinder boring and all that stuff. Lathe work and welding can both become a never ending rabbit-hole, or a fascinating hobby in their own right. Something for when I’m no longer safe (?!) riding on a motorcycle..
I took the Innova out finally on a proper shakedown run to the Ponderosa Cafe (N. Wales) today. 50 miles and all seemed good. Few bikes there today, though a new (Chinese) Gold Star BSA, and a “proper” BSA A65 from the 60s/70s. Nice to have a chat with a few riders.
Les
06/06/2024 16:13:26 UTC
underboner. said :-
Pretty welds are like a work of art. They only come with years of practice and an understanding of the science behind the fusing of metals. It's like anything. if pretty welds were not necessary professional welders would not bother with them, they'd just wack some pigeon poo welds on and that would suffice. But they don't, they take great pride in making welds that are strong and aesthetically pleasing because that's the correct way to do it.
I'm not saying that your welds will not hold but in my years of engineering experience, good welds look like good welds.
01/09/2024 20:54:09 UTC
Upt'North ¹ said :-
There are welders and there are grinders.
Unfortunately I'm a grinder but I do like to see a good flowing weld.
Upt.
01/09/2024 21:07:13 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Underboner,
Thanks for the comment, and I completely agree with you regarding the value of training, and need to be doing a ‘proper job’ as they say in the West Country. I served a 5 year apprenticeship as a motor mechanic, and another 4 years full-time college training to qualify in a second calling, so I’m not decrying training nor doing a job right.
However, watch the ‘responsible’ welding channels on YT and you’ll see warnings that it’s possible to make ‘pretty’ welds that do not penetrate the substrate correctly and they break or are unreliable. I’ve built a car chassis (from scratch) and items of workshop equipment as well as motorcycle parts and managed to do it with acceptable distortion and adequate strength for the job.
We all have a responsibility to ourselves, our families and other road users to do it right, but there are plenty of people who do a good job as ‘home mechanics’ on their own machinery yet who didn’t have formal training. I had a brother-in-law and have a nephew and great nephew who are involved in motorsport with no formal mechanic’s training, yet I’d trust their work with my life - and have.
On a tack back to the original subject… The Innova has now gained a few changes and looks better (I think) for them.
Les
09/09/2024 13:43:54 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
That's just so funky Lesrev!
10/09/2024 12:14:21 UTC
Lesrev said :-
Not sure if anyone is reading this article any longer but I’ve done a couple of mods recently that has improved my “Innova Experience”. The first was fitting a 15 tooth gearbox sprocket (1 tooth larger than standard). The bike now cruises at a genuine 50 mph, though hills need a change-down to 3rd gear. Bonus feature is that it has made the speedo accurate up to 50mph - checked with my sat-nav. Above 50 it still is very yonderly, but my Innova doesn’t live up there!
Second mod, I’ve fitted rear suspension units intended for a CB125F, needed new bush-centre made up for the top bushes (for 10mm bolt instead of 12mm) my Initial impression (short ride only) is much better ride and an end to the pogo-stick rear-end experience.
Les
11/10/2024 21:29:28 UTC
Lesrev said :-
REN,
Thanks! Actually “Funky” is a good adjective for this machine, that covers most people’s reaction to it. Interesting that wherever I park it it gets lots of attention. I even had to hold one older lady’s walking stick while her husband took her picture next to the bike!!
Les
11/10/2024 21:33:22 UTC
nab301 said :-
This iteration of the bike is brilliant , the rear (vented ) panels just seem to give it a properly finished look and it seems to be a useable bike on the road , fair play for persevering and possibly inspiring others!
Nigel
13/10/2024 11:59:31 UTC
Ren - The Ed¹ said :-
That's the right kind of attention Lesrev, most people see my handguards and look away in disgust! However as will be revealed in a future story, my handguards got me recognised the other week. They are... infamous!
14/10/2024 07:56:34 UTC
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